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Crossing the Great Bald Divide
5/22/02 11:42:17 AM Eastern Daylight Time
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Ross:
> GameMaster: My girl Jenny in Florida I told you about...Sunday school
teacher, married, Like a good seducer, I validated that and we moved on
with the conversation. BIG MISTAKE. Actually I had scuttled the whole thing
by giving her the validation that her self-esteem and ego craved, and had
never gotten either as a child, or in her primary relationship. Lesson
learned.
Ross: While I can appreciate and indeed ADVOCATE AND TEACH recognizing and
standing up to a woman's tests and not taking any bullshit, it seems to me
that GameMaster is relishing and even getting a sadistic glee off of
playing on this disturbed woman's worst fears and weaknesses.
GameMaster: Respectfully, yes I am. We have history. Besides, women have
used pussy and psychology to control us for decades...this is no different.
Ross: Honestly, if the only way you can "win" is by tormenting a disturbed
human, maybe the game isn't worth the candle. No doubt it is better than
letting such folks manipulate YOU, but surely, there are better choices and
healthier women out there than this girl who is likely going to turn into a
stalker sometime soon. She sounds like she is a borderline personality with
severe fears of abandonment.
GameMaster: Jeez, my God complex must really be showing through! : )
Actually, she's outwardly very stable and grounded. I think a lot of what
she's reacting to is the fact that maybe I've become the person she wished
I had been ten years ago, and nobody has ever been able to handle her, or
say no to her. Honestly I don't think I'm pushing it that far with her,
just establishing who's in control. And I've had women come after me with
hammers and butcher knives before so I know when enough is enough.
BTW, did I tell you she asked me to marry her yesterday? Must be doing
something right. Wonder what her husband would think about that?
Ross: Trust me, GameMaster, while you are enjoying the power and control
you have over this emotional-wreck right now, what you are feeding into
your ego is, in reality, a poison that will warp your view of the world. Be
careful about what feeds the ego and makes you feel powerful...it never
comes without a cost.
GameMaster: OK Ross, you got me there. Absolutely no argument, that was
very profound.
Ross: Here is the thing: underneath the ego being fed, swelling back up
and feeling good, there are also others snacking parasitically on the same
meal: rage, pain, fear, self-righteousness and the notion that the "other"
is so wrong that anything we do is justified.
This woman cannot beat you and you will be able to stomp any like her who
come along. But you will be also feeding those aspects of your AFC emotions
that are still pushing you forward and robbing you from selecting women who
won't need or want or respond to this kind of thing..women you could
actually admire, love, enjoy and learn from. You'll never meet or draw them
or keep them if you continue too much longer to play with women like this.
So, in the long term, it is in your self-interest to let her go. That is my
point.
GameMaster: And maybe I do have a slightly cynical view of women but I
learned these lessons the hard way. But I've seen it over and over again
where some poor AFC, me included, gave himself over unconditionally to a
relationship only to have his heart carved into a thousand pieces, and
thrown in the deep freezer for later consumption.....bit by bit. I love
women but I hate what they do to guys. So let me enjoy my power trip,
willya? I think 'gleefully sadistic' pretty much captures the program in a
nutshell.
Ross: Personally, I'd walk...no, make that RUN, from this deeply disturbed
woman who can only respond to the worst you can bring forth.
Enjoy the power trip, but look at the imprint and image of woman you are
unknowingly and hypnotically re-inforcing and re-imprinting into the
deepest levels of your mind as what you can and will continue to draw.
There ARE women who are NOT like this one, not motivated like this one,
etc. (Although virtually all women WILL test you.)
The pain, rage and fear that comes from being shattered by cunts like this
can fixate into our minds that indeed, the ONLY choices are being victims
or persecutors, when in fact, the ability to choose people who aren't like
this lady at all is the REAL winning ability.
How many will you emotionally stomp and properly play until the need goes
away and what will you do with all the rage, pain and fear that has grown
fat and powerful off of your continuing psychic sacrifice? I am here to
tell you that it will want continued feeding..and if you don't feed it
through your relations with women, it will pick some other area in your
life (financial, health, friendships, whatever) to insure you continue to
feed it.
The danger in the game is to you, NOT to others...but what feels good is
VERY seductive. It is seldom we see that what feels good in the moment
might actually be something to avoid or at least choose to gradually set aside.
GameMaster Responds: Me and Ross need to go have a sit down sometime and
discuss the dark side of seduction. I think he actually missed my original
point about "needs" and "validation." I really didn't think it came across
as being gleefully sadistic in the way I'm treating Jenny. I think maybe he
may have reacted to my comments about Virgo guys being fuck sluts and
pigeonholing his brothers but I'll stick by my analysis, cause it's fucking
dead on....however, I digress.
Yeah, I'm using everything in the arsenal to get what I want from Jenny,
which is HER! Now that I think about it, Ross did miss my point so I'll
retrace my steps. My little drill with her was rocking right along until
she made the unsolicited reference to ME giving her the "approval" that she
had lacked as a child. That hardly sounds like I'm torturing the poor girl
now does it? And I validated that just like I'm supposed to and didn't
linger on the subject. My point was, that armed with that sincere
validation that I had bestowed on her, and unknowing this was something
lacking from her childhood memories, she bolted. It was the very next day
that she hit
me with the news that "I can't see you again." I wasn't using that as a
shameless opportunity to plug Anne's book, maybe Ross disagrees with her
premise, but I honestly think she's onto something about a major element of
attraction being tied to the "negative combined traits of the parents." My
action plan with everybody is designed around a deep understanding of this
theory which boils down to this "Give them everything they need, and half
of what they want." That's basically it. And I did get her back in the
stable but not by being warm and sensitive, but by being cold and totally
insensitive, so who's right and who's wrong?
And while I'm on this rant, where are all these normal, well adjusted women
I'm reading about? They're certainly not running around inside the last
several generations that were given birth in this country. All fucking
whack jobs as far as I'm concerned and some may view that as a twisted
perception of the world but I think it's a lot closer to reality than most
people are willing to acknowledge. And at 48 I'm entitled to that opinion
cause I EARNED IT. And my affection for church girls will bear me out on
this, and I will say it again,,,,,,, church pussy is the best - heads and
shoulders above the rest of the crowd. Now, if I can turn married Sunday
School teachers and ministers into insatiable whores what does that say
about the state of the world we live in, my friends?
And Ross, I think you know that I have the utmost respect for you and the
things you teach. I took it all in, and when I needed it the most, and then
adapted it to my personality and style. I think that's what we're supposed
to do. But in any discussion about "doorways" there needs to be mention of
the door to their dark nature....and I am continually surprised to find
that it's there with all these women. It's only how you introduce yourself
to the other side of that door that has be fluid and very subtle. But on
that first glimmer of recognition, you can go charging in there like the
Devil incarnate and you have now taken ownership, or possession....so to
speak. And I rather enjoy that. Shoot me. Now I'm off for a haircut where I
have to keep reminding my barber not to trim above the "665" I have
tattooed on the back of my neck. : )
(Separate writing by GameMaster) Here's what I did to Chris when I found
out she had this hidden attraction to other women that nobody knew about. I
had been feeding her all the usual erotic descriptions during foreplay but
one night I had a brainstorm. I told her I loved her so much that if she
ever wanted to fuck another guy then that was OK with me as long as I was
with her too. It was about 5 days later that she invited me over for dinner
with her friend Rachel....what a night that was. But Rachel fucked that all
up when she asked Chris for my number.
Anyway, I think I may have stumbled onto a hidden trigger mechanism that
allowed her to finally allow herself to make that happen. And really, these
women know better than to ever tell us they want to be with another guy.
We'd next these fucking chicks so fast it would make their heads spin. But
you told her it was OK, and now it's reciprocal. But the odds of you ever
having to back that up are nil....unless you're into that sort of thing :
)) Women are going to fantasize about this shit anyway so you may as well
give them permission. I don't know why but it seems to work. I've already
laid that on Nancy too and it sent her over the edge, too. Fuckin' women?
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Prem:
To Mark B.: Most of your comments and stories are strikingly similar to my
own successes and issues:
Just like you mentioned, every time I have succeeded with an HB10 it was
because I approached her with a positive attitude but also with absolutely
NO hesitation and NO care for what the outcome will be. Every time, I had
approached with a direct compliment. Same deal regarding stating my own
opinions, speaking out my mind, teasing and being very comfortable with
just being myself, and these have led me to coital bliss.
However, I cannot seem to consistently remain in that non-caring state
during the approach. Most of my approaches are done during daytime, no
bars/clubs. You mentioned once that you once had an internal fear of women,
that you would see the girl, and instead of approaching right away you
would walk by her first and then come back to approach her moments later. I
have the exact same issue, even though I have done over a hundred
approaches, there is still this internal block...I see her, kind of take
about a minute to make up my mind and then approach.
How did you overcome this internal fear so that you could consistently be
in the no-fear state?? I do occasionally approach a girl in this non-caring
state but have problems consistently maintaining it.
Mark B. responds:
First I am not really sure what you mean by non-caring state. Whether you
are referring to not caring about the outcome or not caring what she thinks
I can address both issues. And yes I used to be afraid of women. So afraid
that if a woman would look me in the eye I would literally look away and
sometimes even run away from her and the situation. But this was really due
to my low esteem due to my acne problems when I was in my teens. It took me
time to get over this problem and I did it by simply going out there and
doing things and saying things to women simply out of the blue without
really being concerned about the outcome or what they thought. I have been
accused many times of being somewhat insensitive in terms of saying what is
on my mind and being this way with women has helped me to say and do
whatever I wanted with them with little or no fear. I was able to just say
these things to women without caring about the result because I did not
think that I would get anywhere with them anyway. But I was able to see the
effects I was able to have on the women and take my lessons from there.
Regarding the issue of being non caring let's look at not caring about the
outcome first. I do not believe that you can ever really become non caring
about the outcome. Caring is a part of our humanity and not caring is
something that we cannot really ever get rid of as human beings. And I feel
that we should never want to get rid of caring about what happens. I read
in the book Emotional Intelligence about people that have had the emotional
center of their brain severed from the logical center of the brain by
accident or to eliminate seizures only to totally deprive the individual
from connecting any sort of an emotional impact from his rational choices.
The individuals looked and acted normal but since they were not able to
make any emotional attachment to their choices they consistently made wrong
decisions and could not conduct themselves in social situations or hold
jobs, etc. Hence our emotional side helps us keep proper judgement and keep
us in line from driving off the cliff because we do not feel any fear so to
speak.
However sometimes out fear become so debilitating that we are immobilized.
This I feel is a function of your body rather than your mind and here
limiting caffeine, eating a balanced diet including red meat and hard
boiled eggs, getting a good nights sleep, getting good exercise and
meditation helps to calm the body and hence the mind. Our organs are
connected through the nervous systems to various parts of the brain and if
any organs are out of proper working order our emotions are effected and no
amount of NLP or otherwise will help us.
I do care about the outcome and still get nervous but in my nervousness I
feel a calm aggression and the desire to move forward and meet her, talk to
her, and approach her. At the same time I look back at my successful
pickups and I also keep in mind that there are women out there that are
waiting to meet me and be approached. This keeps me motivated and going
forward. When I approach a woman I always do so with a smile and a light
hearted playful attitude, I compliment them and tease them a bit and go for
a another meeting for coffee where I could get to know them better. Rather
than suggesting I want to fuck them or have a relationship I just want to
have a chance to spend time with them to show them that they have something
to benefit from by being with me. After all, I am the one that has
approached her and I need to show her that she can feel good around me and
stand to gain something of value from me. I do not buy into the idea that
they should prove themselves worthy to me right away. Since I approached
them they have already passed the initial test with me. They have something
to prove on the first date or meeting where they are passing the test as
much as I am as well.
Regarding caring about what she thinks, I feel that still as a human being
you cannot ever stop caring but you can show that you do not. I feel that
it's the women's biological duty to be approached and found desirable as a
woman. This is what propagates the species. I feel that any woman that does
not find a good natured sincere approach flattering, even if she is not
interested, is not fulfilling her biological role as a good propagators of
the human race. I have met women that were married and had bf's or had no
interest in me but found my approach flattering and indulged in my
attention. In these types of approaches my interaction, with them was so
positive that they sometimes expressed sorrow that they could not get
together with me out of other commitments. But still some with husbands or
boyfriends are still willing to stray but these women I only want for
fucking anyways since the odds of them doing to me what they did to the
other guy are high and this I want to avoid.
I still care what they think of course but this does not mean that I am
going to be careful with what I say I want and what I do. I realized that
the more bold you can be while keeping what you say and do funny and light
you can get away with asking for and doing virtually anything with a woman.
I routinely approach a group of women after leaving a club and say "hey
girls, what do you say we all get a hotel room and have a wild orgy, all of
you and my friends here?" Some actually said yes with a laugh but rather
than go for it they gave me their phone numbers. I have told women, while
smiling of course, that I would like to have a wild passionate love affair
with them or a night of wild love making or take a hot shower. Not once was
a woman ever turned off to leave or to give me a disgusted look. Therefore
with respect to caring, I do care about their reaction to what I do and say
but not so much to the content itself and what I say but rather how I say it.
Here facial and body language» is key - lots of smiling and laughing along
the way keeps it light and fun and allows you to get away with anything and
keep your interaction positive. I have noticed that it's not the rejection
that we fear but we tend to fear a negative reaction from the other person.
If we can somehow make each interaction fun and positive, the rejection and
the no's suddenly holds less stings and makes us motivated to find other
potentially better qualified women.
With respect to timing, I too have somewhat of a block with respect to
making my move right away and I am working on this. Sometimes I see a woman
and I hesitate because she caught me off guard and I am not sure what to
say. I guess I fear her not thinking that I really want her because I just
saw her and perhaps she would be better convinced that I want her if I
watched her for while But this I realize is a block I have and I am working
on this myself. I am getting better and better. I also have a somewhat
tough time going up to her after she has already seen me. These are all
issues I am working on and I feel that once I can overcome them I feel that
my rate of approaching women will double, triple or even quadruple.
Over the last few months after work I have been meeting with a few of my
male friends at the Sherway gardens in Toronto which is a mall for coffee.
We sit it a popular area with lots of women passing by every minute. As an
attractive woman walks by I most of the time say to her "hello gorgeous".
Most white women just walk by without even looking back while most ethnic
women - black, Indian or otherwise stop and say hello back and blush but
they keep walking. Usually the more attractive and confident woman the more
responsive she will be. Sometimes I will make very direct eye contact with
a woman and she will see that I am looking at her and she will walk back
and forth a few times around us just to show that she is available for the
asking. But not one woman has ever sat down with us after our invitation
for coffee. I realized that this is due to the relative lack of effort that
we show these women by simply calling out to them as they walk by and we
are sitting. Women want and need to be shown that we have taken a risk to
meet them and gone out of our way to meet them. This is the biological
basis where they feel you are courageous enough to fight through hell for her.
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DB:
>Jeff Y: I think I've set a new record. 6 girls in a row have flaked out
on meeting me. Can anyone top that?
DB: I can't top that, but I had a flake that shut me out completely so I
didn't even get a chance to be firm to the vixen when I tried to call back.
Before I go any further, the flake was mainly my fault, in addition she was
a youngin (probably 21 or so).
I recently sarged an HB at a coffee shop who was studying for an exam.
Rather than go into the details, I'll just say I got great reactions from
her. My routine I am sure was flawed, but overall she was really into what
I was saying. At the end, she asked me if I come around the coffee place
much and said no I didn't but I got her number and email address. Before I
go further, I feel confident that I could have gotten her back to my place
for some physical contact due to the reactions I got, but because she got a
call from a friend who asked her to visit her (while she was with me) she
suddenly had plans. I didn't act soon enough and I blew the chance. I tried
to leave her in suspense by telling her I knew something special about her
(from palmistry) and that we would continue later. Basically, she is afraid
to tell her mother she is bi, based on a poem she showed me, among other
things.
Anyway, I called her the next day and her roommate said she wasn't home. I
called her again, and the phone was disconnected (temporarily), and
continues to be so. I have little hope for it, but I sent her a nasty email
similar to something RJ posted on the SS list and the fastseduction list.
If her phone is disconnected, I doubt if she will ever read it, if it all,
but it's all I got.
As Major Mark said, you can succeed at this as quickly as you want or
prolong it ad nauseum. I have got to get over this mental block of same day
closes from a public, non bar place. As RJ said about strippers, I say
about youngins', fuck em that day or you never will....
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Stephane:
> Gregory Rasputin: Your personality is not determined by the stars, period.
Stephane: Ok Rasp, think about this. It is a well-known fact that the MOON
causes the oceans to rise and fall. And guess what? YOU are nothing more
than water with a few chemicals spinning in the right direction. So how can
the planets, how can the universe NOT affect you?? It's true that Astrology
is mostly run by business criminals trying to make a quick buck off of
lonely, gullible people but saying that you are not affected in some way by
the planets is like saying you are not affected by tight jeans creeping up
a 17year-old's perfect little ass crack.
(Stephane on a different topic:)
Here's an interesting 'field-report' from last night. I just moved into my
new condo 2 weeks ago but haven't 'christened' it yet (until last night)
because I just got out of the hospital and haven't felt like myself these
days. This is the first time I've gotten laid in a month. I suppose my
success and motivation had something to do with having David over for a BBQ
last night.
Spend 10 minutes with Dave and something happens...deep inside...and next
thing you know, you're out there picking up broads like crazy....he has a
way with words.
So anyway, I went out to the local pool hall for a drink and saw this new
bartender there, HB 8.5, 33-years-old (I'm 26). I introduced myself and
then I grabbed her arm gently and whispered in her ear, "I bet you could
teach me a thing or two : )
She laughed and said, "You're right -- I could." I said, "That's good news
because I'm tired of these virgins....they look great but they don't know
shit." She laughed and made a comment on my 'directness' to which I said,
"Not everyone can handle honesty. Can YOU?" She accepted my challenge and
said that she could handle honesty. So I said, "That's good because I just
bought a new condo and I'd HONESTLY like to christen it tonight with
you...you'd look really good in front of my fireplace holding a glass of wine."
She said, "I get off at 3am." I said, "Well there's no way I'm sticking
around this place until 3 am, so here's my address. Be at my place as soon
as you're done. And make sure you show up, because a good heart like mine
breaks easily : )"
She showed up and I fucked her, but she didn't teach me shit : )
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Flyer:
Apparently Mr. Ray Gordon has decided to make all of his seduction info
free to the web, in light of what he feels is harassment in the seduction
community.
Here is where the "Perfect Seduction" book is located, which is the new one
to me, and am not certain if you have it
http://www.cybersheet.com/library/perfectintro.html
There is one passage from the last page on that book:
"Striking A Balance What is the bottom line, after almost 300,000 words and
four books of The Seduction Library, and another 100 million or so words of
everyone else's? For men, I believe it is striking a balance between being
a nice guy and losing sex because of it or being a jerk and getting the sex
and then feeling guilty about it. Even the successful players of ASF have
pondered this question painfully, and their reflections shine a much
different light on reality than Foxes would like to have us see. Most men,
even the ones we call jerks, are decent men at heart, but have the problem
of being punished sexually for that decency, and having to choose between
that fate or getting the sex they want and being punished for the behavior
that Foxes require of them to get laid.
A recurring theme on ASF is the chick-logic post where one of the males
gets sex from a Fox only when he treats her like shit. In one case, he even
turned it on and off like a faucet just to prove his point, and each time
she changed her behavior in reaction to his. The reward system was so
obvious it was impossible to ignore, and it raised a simple question most
Foxes don't want to deal with: (end snip)
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Maximillian Hell:
A short piece that I found in a women's-feminist newspaper in Seattle. This
guy seems to know many of our tricks!
Here's the link. The story is also
below. http://www.vervewomen.com/current_issue/0402-vd-01.htm
vivid dating
Crossing the Great Bald Divide by Anonymous
Since age 20, I've been telling my friends I could not date a bald guy.
Then I met one, organically. Organic dates are the best. They happen the
way God intended -- spontaneously, naturally, like finding the perfect
bathing suit or pair of jeans. You can't want it too bad; you can't need to
find something. You are just shopping, and open, and then it happens.
Voila. I met Roger at happy hour at the Metropolitan Grill. The Met has
awesome $1.00 happy-hour, roast beef sandwiches. I was meeting a girlfriend
and her co-workers. Roger tagged along. There were five women, one guy.
Roger has intense eyes. The six of us were drinking designer beers and
eating the dollar hors d'oeuvres, when he caught my gaze and held it. And
held it. And held it. It was almost like having sex in a crowd. I don't
have sex in crowds, so I must use the qualifier "almost." Later that same
night he emailed me. I saved the email. I want a date. When? I swooned. I
read, and reread, his email every hour on the hour for about a day. I
envisioned him to be a guy who knew what he wanted; someone who knew
himself from time spent in inner reflection; a man who knew how to be
intense with a woman; someone who wasn't afraid of intimacy.
We dated. His baldness became a non-issue. All of a sudden I related to
Jean Luc Picard in a new way. Jay Buhner became my favorite Mariner.
Baldness became sexy to me when it came packaged in a person who makes eye
love; someone strong and intense; someone who is so Scorpio.
This is not, however, a Happily Ever After story. As it turns out, as I got
to know him better, he doesn't have time for a girlfriend. His schedule is
a bit overwhelming with two new businesses or, at least, that is what he
told me.
So it didn't work out. But that's OK. He was honest in his rejection email.
The memory of three minutes of straight eye contact in a crowded bar is
good. All those people faded into nothing for a moment. And I got over my
bald issue. I was stretched a little. And that's all good.
Yes, Jean Luc Picard.
Yes, Scorpio bald men.
The reason I let this fish go is that his intensity of eye gaze didn't mean
what I thought it meant. When I offered to have more intimacy, when I
offered to take our relationship to the next level, he got really busy. I
started getting really brief, two-liner emails. "How are you doing. Really
busy- I'll write later." He wanted to kiss me the last time I saw him.
Did I mention he played in a band and has stock options? Did I mention he's
funny? Did I mention he's hard working and is very considerate to wait
staff? Did I mention that he drives an old beat up truck? I love beat up
trucks. Did I mention that he has lots of friends and they get together
regularly for those Big Chill kinds of reunion weekends? Did I mention that
he has season tickets to the ballet and the Mariner's? Guess not. He was
quite a great catch. And I let this one go. And it wasn't because he was
bald. He got busy with work, and moving, and other excuses. To this day, I
don't think that he was/is avoiding me. I think he genuinely enjoys our
time together. I think he just doesn't want to or know how to take things
to the next level. Three weeks ago, we did an exercise. We looked into each
other's eyes for 18 minutes (this is fact, not exaggeration). I was
surprised at his capacity. In response to my amazement (18 minutes is a
chunk of good intimacy, try it. Just look and don't stop. Where doesn't
sustained eye contact take you? How long can you go?), he said, "I am very
capable of intimacy, I just pick wrong partners." In this case, I'm left
wondering. Was that an accurate self-reflection, or is he really running
away just when things were getting intimate? Or maybe his bad picking is
coming back to haunt him. I'm a good pick.
At least for him I am. Or at least that's how it seems to me. But once
again, that's coming from that sixth dating sense. The one that keeps
signaling information that doesn't quite match the man's interpretation.
Oh, the weird world of dating. It is such a pickle. Such a
sour/sweet/crunchy/soft pickle. And despite my kvetching, I really do love
all this love intrigue. It's so awesome to offer a guy some legitimate
intimacy, no strings attached, total direction left up to him. To offer
that with a wide open, soft heart, no scars and then watch him bug out of
town. Not what I suspected from those intense eyes that first meeting. Does
any of this make sense?
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NOT REVIEWED YET:
|
| cliff’s free plugs section |
Cliff’s Comment: The following are all
recommended but clicking on the links and buying from them doesn’t send any money back
here (it is also recommended that the sponsors of these sites consider setting this up —
from the little experience I have had since I started the commercial section a couple of
weeks ago, I think you are missing a lot of business by not doing this):
|
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