mASF post by "hotlab"
posted on: alt.seduction.relationships, May 5, 2005On 5/18/05 12:06:00 PM, zarathustra_fi wrote:
>On 5/18/05 8:07:00 AM, hotlab wrote:
>
>Personally I gave in my life and still
>give a lot of pleasure, love and support
>directly to women. I hug my wife, I tell
>her I love her, I keep her on my chest,
>I support her in moments of
>difficulties.
Then this works for you to get what you want from her... for me it works too.
>
>I think the answer to your question is
>that as PUAs we realize the negative
>effects on female attraction of "too
>much rapport/pleasure".
Quite often this comes from an imbalance... either an imbalance of love or an
imbalance of power.
>
>I have been thinking a lot about this
>Tony Robbins principle of people
>avoiding pain and looking for pleasure.
>
>I think it applies only to VERY healthy
>individuals because most of the people
>are fucked up in a way or another and
>also look for pain.
No, it applies to everybody but it's not always easy to figure out which kind
of pain and/or pleasure people focus on. Also what is pain for one person can
be pleasure for another. Dying is pretty painful for most people, but Kamikaze
fighters have been doing it and got pleasure from it.
So my conclusion would rather be that women who get horny when treated badly
have some pretty fucked up associations in their mind.
That said, "Art of Seduction" is full of subtle painful ways to seduce someone.
But Robert Greene also writes that you can't seduce, i.e. manipulate, someone
who is completely satisfied with his/her life. The only way to draw someone
like that into your life is to add more pleasure to what she or he already has.
>
>I am not sure if Tony Robbins is a PUA
>but I am sure that if he would look
>closely to what women are he would
>quickly find out that women attraction
>is linked to NON RAPPORT/NON PLEASURE at
>least as much as to pleasure and
>rapport.
Tony Robbins said in the introduction to his "Personal Power" program that
after applying the techniques he learned from a friend when he was completely
broke, emotionally, physically and financially, he found the woman of his
dreams within one year and married her.
So he surely was not a PUA, but I guess he didn't want to be a PUA. He wanted
to find the woman of his dreams and he did.
BTW, I started with this program in the end of 2003 and found the woman of my
dreams within a year too.
>
>Why it is that? My interpretation is
>this: most of the women are actually
>bisexual and they tend on a deeper level
>to ENJOY a lot pleasure and rapport when
>they get it from a man BUT when this man
>is giving to them pleasure and rapport
>too much they tend unconsciously to
>start to feel this man as.. A WOMAN.
It is the imbalance that causes this effect... so it is correct when you say
that too much rapport is bad for the attraction. But what constitutes too much
rapport is very specific for a woman and also for the stage of the
relationship. A little bit of rapport can be too much... and a lot of rapport
can still be not enough.
Also when a healthy relationship grows, the need for rapport grows too.
>
>So the primary source of SWEET EMOTIONAL
>SUPPORT for a woman has always been and
>will always be ANOTHER WOMAN.
I disagree... see below.
>A man can
>take this role ( I know you are very
>good in this Hotlab ) but if this goes
>too far it will kill the attraction on
>the longer term.
Of course it kills the attraction if it goes too far... it has to be
calibrated. The balance of love and power is always threatened. This is what
happens when confident guys suddenly become needy when they are in a
relationship.
But you don't need to inflict obvious pain...
... it is sufficient to reduce the pleasure you give her occasionally to
re-create the desired tension. That's pain too, BTW... it creates fear of loss,
but it is not something like insulting her or creating anger which could result
in a lasting damage.
This is what a woman wrote to me. And you can believe me that she has her shit
down:
"A great rake I know, would commonly tell his new women that he knew he was
obvious, but they were so beautiful he couldn't help it... Whatever he did, it
was because he was afraid that he was in love with them, or desperate to have
them or whatever... He would do ANYTHING just to be a part of their lives, even
if it meant he could never be their lover..."
"So you admit to your weakeness and spend some time proving how devoted you are
and demonstrating that you are willing to accept things on her terms just to be
in her life... You lead her down the rosy path by convincing her that she
solidly has the upper hand... Of course, she will try to play games with you...
Let her win them all at first... This is like "hustling" in pool... You let
them beat you several times before the game gets really serious..."
"After she's feeling all safe & secure that she has you in her back pocket and
has GOTTEN USED TO HAVING YOU AROUND, WHICH YOU WILL BE ABLE TO TELL BECAUSE
SHE WILL START TO CALL YOU FIRST WHEN THINGS HAPPEN IN HER LIFE, you can start
to pull back a little... Start showing other women a bit more attention, but be
subtle... Let her sense a problem rather than telling her outright that your
attention is wandering... If you get creative, you will find a million little
ways to worry her without ever having to say much about another woman... You'll
know your'e doing it right when she starts using tricks & creating drama to
keep your attention focused on her..."
So you know that you have her if she replaces her girlfriends with you. Then
you keep the tension... but subtly.
>
>
>So this is why I am deeply convinced
>that mixing pleasure and rapport with
>non rapport and pain is a prerequisite
>to give the woman on the longer term the
>feeling that she is in presence of
>masculinity.
In principle I agree, but it's not about the masculinity and it's not necessary
to inflict really bad emotions.
It's the imbalance and this works both ways. If you have too much power over a
woman or if she loves you way more than you love her, then you get bored and
loose interest in her too. This creates some feelings of guilt or duty in you
and you start wanting to have more freedom.
>
>Are women looking for COMMUNICATION from
>men? No. If we have a walk through the
>bars and restaurants of all the world (
>I have travelled a lot and still travel
>a lot ) we will see very often women in
>SET OF TWO giving therapy, pleasure and
>closenes to each other.
They almost always prefer a man for communication, even when they aren't
physically attracted to him. Just think about all the guys who have been
LJBFed. But women need the communication more then men, so they talk with women
if they don't find a man who gives them attention. And often they don't find a
man because we don't like that much to talk with them if they don't want to
fuck us, don't we?
>
>Rarely women look for this from a man
>and this happens for two reasons:
>
>- Most of the men are would not be able
>to give to women the "lesbian" feeling
>of deep and sweet communication
Yes, that's true. But labeling this a "lesbian feeling" is a mistake. It's
something you can use to your advantage to seduce them.
>- Women are scared themselves to ask for
>this from men - WHILE ASKING FOR THIS
>FROM THEM! - because they are scared of
>their men becoming FEMININE.(because
>they know that the power of their Yin
>CAN make men become feminine)
They are not scared of their men becoming feminine. They are scared of their
men becoming needy. We are scared too of our women becoming needy. Or do you
enjoy being with a needy woman? I don't. In fact, a needy woman appears to me
to be less feminine... and this is because she lacks confidence. The same
applies vice versa. If the balance is in her favor, you become needy and loose
confidence and then you appear to be less masculine of course.
But the most important point to keep in mind is that SHE usually DOESN'T WANT
THE IMBALANCE. It just happens because the guy stops to play the game once he
thinks he has her.
hotlab
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